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Old Mar 25 2006, 10:38 PM   #1
Shani
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Default Queen firelizards and Flaming?

This was mentioned in another thread and I thought I'd leave it on topic and start a new one.
Someone said Todd put in one of his books that Queen Firelizards can't Flame (can't you tell I've not read the books yet). In Dragonsdawn it was clearly said that all types of Firelizards can chew Firestone and Flame, and the Riders were confused when the Gold Dragons could not... (kitty Ping changed the DNA on the golds)

So... Huh? Did I misunderstand the post or has history been rewritten?
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Old Mar 25 2006, 11:29 PM   #2
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

Most likely, history is being rewritten. Given that he apprently came up with fire lizards eating thread from a line in Dragonquest, he most likely forgot what was written in Dragonsdawn. He desperately needs a few fans to read his manuscripts before he publishes them.
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Old Mar 26 2006, 12:29 AM   #3
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

Yes, it is history being rewritten. At the end of Dragonsdawn, when the riders are feeding their dragons firestone, Tarrie (I think) mentions that the stones she's feeding her dragon are really big compared to the pebbles she feeds her queen firelizard.
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Old Mar 26 2006, 12:58 AM   #4
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

Yes. I think that since queens didn't chew firestone (because they were physically incapable, and because the later Dragonriders thought it would make them sterile) that Kylara simply couldn't accept what she saw as flame - or maybe she didn't even see it clearly. She would have been flying Thread at the time, with her concentration on that task; she would have looked over to see her fire lizard fly at a patch of thread and open it's mouth, and the thread disappeared. Under the circumstances I'm not sure she saw much of anything.

I think the 9th-pass Pernese really don't give their lizards firestone - although I'd be very surprised if some didn't, just to see if they could flame!
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Old Mar 26 2006, 03:08 AM   #5
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

Todd doesn't say in any of the books that gold fire-lizards can't flame, but in his answer to my question about whers eating thread, he said something along the lines of eating Thread as being a last resort for most firelizards, and the only option for golds. Can't put up a quote right now, as Todd's new site doesn't have all the newer letters imported yet.
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Old Mar 26 2006, 11:59 AM   #6
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

Kylara THINKS her lizard does...

DQ online source:

"F’lar told me he’d seen your little pet . . .”
“Pet nothing!” Kylara blazed with anger. “She ate Thread yesterday at High Reaches ."
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Old Mar 28 2006, 07:26 PM   #7
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

Uh, yeah, see Brenda's post, she pointed that out.

Todd does have that interview answer where he says greens FIRELIZARDS are sterile because of firestone and queen lizards don't chew it, as quoted on NKT. And I can't decide if he's consciously rewriting history or just really hasn't gone back and reread anything. I wish I'd known in advance a friend of mine was going to be on a panel with him at AggieCon because I'd have asked him to ask on my behalf whether Todd does a lot of rereading or relies on his and his mother's memories of the books. (Of course, my friend's impression of Todd was that Todd has the 'professional guest' routine down pat and found it very hard to tell if he had met the 'real' Todd or a public persona. So answers might be canned, too.)
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Old Mar 28 2006, 08:24 PM   #8
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

I think it's a bit of both... not rereading, and rewriting history because of it.
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Old Mar 29 2006, 12:29 AM   #9
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

I just realized what's really happening here. When humans first came to Pern, Queen firelizards did flame. However, as time passed, humans got this strong idea that chewing firestone would make them sterile. The impressed fire lizards passed this on to the wild ones, and, over time, queen fire lizards stopped chewing firestones because they "remembered" men said it would make them sterile.
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Old Mar 29 2006, 06:02 PM   #10
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

Quote:
I just realized what's really happening here. When humans first came to Pern, Queen firelizards did flame. However, as time passed, humans got this strong idea that chewing firestone would make them sterile. The impressed fire lizards passed this on to the wild ones, and, over time, queen fire lizards stopped chewing firestones because they "remembered" men said it would make them sterile.


No, no, no, no, NO!!!

When humans first came to Pern, they found fire lizards. When Thread fell for the first time, they realized that the fire lizards could flame.

They developed dragons that could do the job better. The golds were physically unable to flame - they vomited up the firestone. Kitti Ping had wanted to ensure that the breeders would not be exposed to danger. (Like that was really going to stop them!) Greens are sterile - my opinion is that Kitti also stuck that in, because the greens fire lizards were so randy and were such poor mothers.

The dragonriders are very, very upset that the queens can't flame - because their gold fire lizards CAN.

Skip to the 9th Pass.

The people have forgotten about fire lizards, but they still have dragons.
Queens don't chew firestone. They are fertile.
Greens chew firestone. They are sterile.
The fact that this is a genetic thing is unknown; the only obvious connection is firestone.

They rediscover fire lizards. Fire lizards are fairly independant. If they want to chew firestone and help flame thread, they will. Just because Kylara didn't feed firestone to her lizard doesn't mean the lizard didn't flame the thread!!!


Basically, you're wrong because you were trying to apply 9th Pass beliefs to 1st Pass colonists.
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Old Mar 29 2006, 06:27 PM   #11
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

Brenda, I think that Falkieri was being sarcastic, hence the ""
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Old Mar 29 2006, 07:59 PM   #12
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

That, or demonstrating retconning. (Please, God, don't let Todd read this...)
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Old Mar 29 2006, 08:32 PM   #13
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

Queen dragons can chew firestone, they just can't keep it down. I can't recall exactly which weyrwoman is was, but she was most annoyed when her queen barfed the stone back up, as did the other queens shortly after.

Also, didn't Menolly see her queen flame thread? When Menolly got caught outside the cave, just before she was rescued. I'm not too sure about that one though.

I think Kitty put in a genetic inhibitor so queens couldn't eat enough stone to produce flame in an attempt to keep them out of the line of fire, so to speak.

Todd obviously doesn't really care what was written before. He seems to pick one or two ideas from the books and then makes up something reguardless of whether or not it actually fits.
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Old Mar 29 2006, 09:50 PM   #14
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

DD online: source

"Who knows how much stoking it takes to start a dragon’s fires?” Tarrie sang out cheerfully. “I’d say this – ” She hefted the stone in her hand. “ – is comparable to the pebble-size I used to feed my gold dragonet. Isn’t it, Porth?”
The queen obediently lowered her head and took the offering.
“The dragonets chew at least a handful before they can flame,” Dave Catarel said, but he was watching Polenth dubiously as the bronze worked his jaws with the same solemn contemplative look the others had. “Look, Sorka, your fair’s setting the example!”

So Tarrie's gold lizard DID flame.

"An hour later, all the males had produced flame, but none of the females had; though the golds had chewed and chewed, one after the other they had regurgitated an awful gray pastelike substance."
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Old Apr 3 2006, 09:06 PM   #15
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Default Re: Queen firelizards and Flaming?

Heh. Wait until it explodes in their faces because it's exposed to the "slightest drop of moisture". That'll show them wimmenfoke not to do a man's work!
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