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Old Oct 5 2008, 09:23 PM   #1
Weyrlady
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Default Green Dragon Voices

Evenin'!

I was trying to remember if there had been any green dragfon pairings in canon literature where the rider was male and the dragon actually spoke, and couldn't come up with any (except for the lovely Beth in DQ, and somehow I don't think that counts.)- at least in books I've read.

I've always thought- and audio versions of the book proved this- that the dragon's voice sounds like a deeper, more echo-ey version of the rider's. For example, Mnementh has the same nifty accent that F'lar has, Canth sounds like F'nor, etc.

So what happens to green dragons and male riders? I don't care what his sexual orientation is, unless szaid green rider had a problem with his vocal development, I highly doubt that he will sound like a woman, ALL THE TIME (maybe when he's liquored up).

Are there any examples of green dragon voices where the rider's male, or can I make K'ben's Amanth sound however I want?
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Old Oct 5 2008, 09:30 PM   #2
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

I would think that, in that case, the green dragon's voice would be a more feminine, echo-ey version of the male rider's voice.
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Old Oct 5 2008, 09:40 PM   #3
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

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Originally Posted by kevia View Post
I would think that, in that case, the green dragon's voice would be a more feminine, echo-ey version of the male rider's voice.
I agree with this. Reason being is that if you're thinking of Yin and Yang, then the two would make a whole. The green dragon would be perhaps considered to be the female half of the male dragon-rider when speaking to other dragons as well as her rider. Question here, is that why some of them end up being homosexual when green dragons "mate" with bronze/brown dragons? Surely the riders go "O shards, it's only in the heat of the moment, does it really matter?" I don't know! As I'm purely hetrosexual, I can't answer that question as to why one would go that way. I realize this is probably showing up in other threads but I just can't think where Anyway that's just me!
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Old Oct 5 2008, 11:18 PM   #4
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

Well I not to sure if this well help or not in DQ F'rad green did try to warn F'lar after that odd Threadfall just before the Teglar wedding.
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Old Oct 6 2008, 03:26 AM   #5
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

I would think the accent and wording choices would be similar to the rider's, but the pitch would be in the feminine range, just because I think the dragons probably pull some of their characteristics from what the rider thinks is socially normal or acceptable. Females have higher voices, therefore female dragons would have higher voices, while still sounding somewhat similar to their riders.

'course...I have no proof of this. But yeah.
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Old Oct 6 2008, 11:23 PM   #6
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

Read over the post just gave me a twig of a idea, would tone work, for male dragons have a deeper tone in say humming?

As for the rest I am real getting to tired to type much tonight.

Also would other autors like A Norton and her Beastmaster's books with there telepath link be of any aid, for I working on once Beastmasters' Quest with both types of pair and diffent tonal on it?
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Old Oct 7 2008, 02:05 AM   #7
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

The thing is, we don't know HOW much deeper dragons voices are. There's often a considerable overlap between male and female vocal ranges anyway, and a vast range within them, and given that the dragon's voice is mental rather than physical, gender-based pitch considerations wouldn't necessarily apply. If you always drop an octave or whatever in the other colour/gender combinations, I see no reason why the same wouldn't be true of greens with male riders.

Ginny, as far as humming goes, now that SHOULD be something where size plays a role. The resonant cavities would be larger in the larger dragons, and you'd almost certainly get deeper tones from the largest dragons, with greens the highest pitched and golds the deepest.
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Old Oct 7 2008, 02:22 AM   #8
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

I'm sure it was mentioned as a third lower in one book. I honestly can't remember which one though.
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Old Oct 7 2008, 05:02 PM   #9
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

I maintain dragons don't have "voices" at all -- why would they? Pure thought is faster, and in any case, dragons don't vocalize more than standard animal noises, so they have no voices of their own to hear and interpret as belonging to them. But the human brain, given its limitations, interprets their telepathy as a "voice."

It would make sense for a dragon to "sound" like its rider because that's who they're imprinted upon, and with whom they most closely associate. But I think that Ramoth probably has a "Lessa-ness," and Canth has a "F'nor-ness," and a green dragon Impressed to a male would have its own R'der-ness. Your brain would interpret a dragon's telepathy as being evocative of the rider, and so it would make sense for your brain to translate that communication as being R'der-but-not-R'der.

Additionally, our mindvoices, the way we sound to ourselves in our own heads, is not actually how we sound when we're speaking -- because our voices reverberate differently in our skulls, we hear ourselves differently than everyone else hears us, and so that's the voice we think in. I'd suggest a dragon would be more influenced by R'der's distinct mindvoice than his actual voice. So it's the rider's voice, but different. A way we never hear it.

Thus, a dragon "sounds," as Anne has said, like the rider through a long tunnel. It's not that there's an echo. It's just that there's a disconnect.
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Old Oct 8 2008, 08:30 AM   #10
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

What Cav said.


Plus, however dragons sound in audiobooks proves nothing but how the reader happens to imagine the voices (and has the ability to reproduce).
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Old Oct 11 2008, 06:15 AM   #11
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

Thats the trouble. Our thoughts sound like our voice to us, but are they?
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Old Oct 11 2008, 11:06 AM   #12
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weyrbrat View Post
Thats the trouble. Our thoughts sound like our voice to us, but are they?
If you mean, are we actually picking up auditory information when we think to ourselves-- no. Obviously we aren't because we're not saying anything. I can't find any studies that have been done on it -- maybe there aren't any -- but I'm sticking with my assertion that it's just the human mind translating pure thought into a way that's familiar and somewhat tangible. I can conceptualize generally and without "words," like when I'm driving somewhere new or thinking about my day or figuring out what I want for dinner. But when I'm writing or proofreading, my brain is relying so heavily on my speech centers anyway -- I'd think -- that I essentially imagine myself speaking to myself. I'm thinking about words, and I'm thinking about which words to use, and my brain just fills in the gaps.

If you mean, are the voices we hear anything like our actual voices-- also, no. What you hear when your voice resonates back to you is the sound in your skull AND through the air, whereas everyone else just hears it traveling through the air. I suspect we all probably hear lower, richer versions of our own voices, which is also consistent with Anne's description of what people "hear" when they "hear" dragons.
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Old Oct 13 2008, 04:09 PM   #13
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Default Re: Green Dragon Voices

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Originally Posted by Weyrbrat View Post
Thats the trouble. Our thoughts sound like our voice to us, but are they?
That goes back to thr question that's posted somewhere: can a deaf person be a dragonrider? Sure!! Why not? What, exactly, is it absolutely essential that you hear, with your ears anyway? Here on Earth, deaf people are anything they want to be- and that's without telepathic communication.Nifty little thing called "learning to adapt." When dragons talk to you, it's not your ears doing the work, just like Cav said. It'd be interesting to meet a character who's "deaf", but has the ability to hear all dragons. I just have to come up with a name for her or him!

I think that dragons do have "voices"- they jmust yak more articulately than cats or dogs. My own dog, for example, is Mr. Silly but also Mr. Highly Intellectual- he'll be reading soon- has his own vocabulary of growls, barks, and "mmmmm" He does "mental e-mail", I pick up emotions from him, I don't '"hear" his voice in my head but I know what he's saying. One thing that I do, especially when meeting folks who may not be as familiar with Macs and how he talks(animals are great for meeting people), is interpret for them, and I've noticed dragonriders doing this for their big friends in the books, too. He definitely has a voice of his own; he just doesn't use full sentences or speak English. Dragons have the market cornered there. I figure he's like a fire-lizard- in the books, when they're young, they don't use words either, they have emotions and images.

My favorite dragon quote is naturally, from Canth, who says, "The strong survive" This always surprises me; what's Canth know about social Darwinism? Go Canth!!!

I also have 2 cats, and they're always complainin'. They're very outspoken, and nobody can understand what they are saying.
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