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Old Mar 7 2014, 03:53 PM   #1
Lily
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Default Toric

What did the future hold for Toric?

We know he grew up in a fishcraft Hold under his father who refused to give him his (Journeyman's?) ticket so he left home.

(I think he would have left home some time anyway, he was too ambitious to continue as he was)

He went in the group that started Southern and ended up leader there and was doing well.

But he got too greedy, came to resent dragon riders, and started taking an interest in what the abominators were doing.

The last we saw of him he was getting into a huddle with the last leader of the abominators.

Why?

Why had he bought in two potentially savage, but well trained working dogs? What were they for?

I think Toric is headed for the dark side! But he has too much to lose. What think you?
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Old Mar 7 2014, 05:37 PM   #2
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I think he resents that he got only a small portion of the south. He was trying to get a bigger hold on the south. The dogs may have been needed as guard or protection. He was making a lot of enemies.

I think he will always be a pain to deal with, just to be difficult. He seems to enjoy making trouble.
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Old Mar 8 2014, 08:21 PM   #3
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He resents that he didn't get the entire Southern Continent!
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Old Mar 9 2014, 11:26 AM   #4
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Default Re: Toric

and that the dragonriders are going to get a lot of it.
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Old Mar 9 2014, 04:40 PM   #5
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Default Re: Toric

Oh yes, but what do you think the future holds for Toric?
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Old Mar 9 2014, 08:09 PM   #6
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He'll die a lonely, bitter old man.
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Old Mar 9 2014, 08:46 PM   #7
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He'll die a lonely, bitter old man.
Well! That's a bit drastic, but I agree with you there. But I would expect him to have several years yet. What will he do with them?
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Old Mar 10 2014, 08:53 PM   #8
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Fight with and alienate his children, make enemies of his neighbors, and be miserable. He;s good at that. Or, and try telling everyone how to love their lives.
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Old Mar 11 2014, 08:16 AM   #9
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Default Re: Toric

I agree with AnnMarie, that is a very good description of Toric and a very plausible end.
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Old Mar 12 2014, 12:46 PM   #10
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Default Re: Toric

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lily View Post
What did the future hold for Toric?


Why had he bought in two potentially savage, but well trained working dogs? What were they for?

I think Toric is headed for the dark side! But he has too much to lose. What think you?
He wanted reliable guard animals to keep strangers out of the Hold -- but not whers because "he couldn't stand the look of the creatures, and they were only really good watchers at night". BTW there were six dogs.

Eriflor.
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Old Mar 16 2014, 11:20 AM   #11
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Default Re: Toric

He'll make as many problems, especially for Jaxom he can. He will vote against him even when he agrees with him. He is that type of person.
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Old Mar 17 2014, 06:06 PM   #12
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Default Re: Toric

Every generation has it's Fax or Meron.

He's both. Nice, tidy package.
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Old Mar 21 2014, 12:52 PM   #13
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Funny there that Kugai beat me to it by a couple of days! My thoughts based on what I can remember (I haven't got to the later books yet!), were that he was slowly starting to turn to the dark side, and was in danger of turning into the next Meron.

Certainly not someone I would want as my next door neighbour...
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Old Mar 22 2014, 11:07 PM   #14
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Default Re: Toric

Toric has forgotten what it means to be a Lord Holder --- like many others probably. His job is to organise the smaller holders and cotholders within his area to clear all greenery from the Hold area, to provide ground-support to the Weyr during Threadfall, and to support (by tithing) the Weyr that protects them. In return, an effective Lord Holder receives the respect of his subordinates, and a position of authority within Pernese society.

But Toric (like Fax) sees his position as Lord Holder mainly as an opportunity to acquire huge amounts of land for himself and his progeny, and is annoyed at the Weyrs for limiting the expansion of his territory.

Ground-support is less necessary in the South because the land is protected by grubs. Toric needs to (1) acknowledge that he already has the biggest territory on all Pern, and (2) talk to his Weyrleaders and negotiate a more favourable exchange of goods and services. Not going to happen, I'm afraid. I don't think he's looking to the future at all, beyond the notion of not having to tithe to those dragon-riding parasites any more.
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Old Mar 23 2014, 04:45 AM   #15
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Default Re: Toric

Hmm, while reading Eriflor's description of toric, the Russian president Putin suddenly sprang to mind
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Old Mar 23 2014, 06:36 PM   #16
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Default Re: Toric

... and Putin is sounding more and more like Hitler.
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Old Mar 25 2014, 07:58 AM   #17
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Default Re: Toric

What do YOU think will happen to Toric, Lily? This being your thread and all...

I'm with AnnMarie on the whole, but I think for plot purposes he'd end up getting caught in some criminal act and get himself impeached. As a reward, he'd get to live a simple life in as large a Hold as he could conquer with his bare, technologically un-aided hands, i.e. a miserable hovel on an island somewhere, thus reaping the karmic rewards of his hypocrisy.
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Old Mar 25 2014, 08:23 AM   #18
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Default Re: Toric

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kath View Post
What do YOU think will happen to Toric, Lily? This being your thread and all...

I'm with AnnMarie on the whole, but I think for plot purposes he'd end up getting caught in some criminal act and get himself impeached. As a reward, he'd get to live a simple life in as large a Hold as he could conquer with his bare, technologically un-aided hands, i.e. a miserable hovel on an island somewhere, thus reaping the karmic rewards of his hypocrisy.
I would love that!!!
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Old Mar 25 2014, 05:11 PM   #19
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Default Re: Toric

There's too many "if's" isn't there. He's passing control of the dogs over to his sons and IF they are strong enough, they'll eventually be able to overrule him.
IF he keeps his health and IF there are enough abominators around still and IF he can assist them without being caught ...................

But eventually, I suspect his greed will catch up with him and he'll lose everything
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Old Mar 25 2014, 05:36 PM   #20
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Perhaps he'd then change his name (in shame) to Cort!
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Old Apr 9 2014, 04:50 PM   #21
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Default Re: Toric

After reading "The Skies of Pern", I'm convinced that Toric is not done meddling in the affairs of dragonriders in the South and the North.

Luckily, the Harper spy (what was his name?) that had followed the Abominators knows that Toric is scheming with the last of them, and Toric will probably go down yet again, after the last Abominator's plan to destroy AIVAS also fails. Toric will be faced with some action by the other Lord Holders and be forced into giving up his Hold, going into exile, or maybe even fleeing further south to avoid his sentencing.

Toric will begin planning a long-range plan to eradicate all dragonmen from the face of Pern.

There, he will gather around him other malcontents and make guerilla strikes against the Southern Weyrs, probably starting with Honshu, since he has a long-standing grudge with F'lessan. Monaco Bay/Eastern Weyrs will also be targets of his wrath.

If Toric goes after the Weyrs, that makes it a dragonman problem, and they will insist that they have the right to engage Toric & his forces and strike back!

But how could Toric ever hope to gain an advantage over the dragonmen and their powerful dragons? Telepathic, Teleporting, and now Telekinetic dragons!

What ancient technology is still hidden in Southern's jungles that Toric could possibly use to his advantage? And those damned retiring dragonmen zipping all over Southern, hogging up all the best spots! Toric will be targeting them as well!
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Old Apr 10 2014, 01:04 AM   #22
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Default Re: Toric

I really can't see there being anything left to find in the jungle that would give him an advantage. All of the really advanced technology - whatever wasn't brought North - was at Landing. If there was anything else, those records would be at Landing as well. And he probably couldn't get anything to work, much less figure out what it was supposed to do in the first place, without extensive access to the computer archives at Landing.

Which he is NOT going to be getting, I'd bet!

Now, it would be funny if he found some little gadget and thought it was something amazing and important and it was, like, a toy...
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Old Apr 10 2014, 03:09 PM   #23
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or a tin opener?
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Old Apr 10 2014, 03:11 PM   #24
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[QUOTE=BronzeRider;191317] <snip>

Luckily, the Harper spy (what was his name?) that had followed the Abominators knows that Toric is scheming with the last of them, and Toric will probably go down yet again, after the last Abominator's plan to destroy AIVAS also fails. Toric will be faced with some action by the other Lord Holders and be forced into giving up his Hold, going into exile, or maybe even fleeing further south to avoid his sentencing. Pinch aka Master Mekelroy
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Old Apr 10 2014, 05:20 PM   #25
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Quote:
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I really can't see there being anything left to find in the jungle that would give him an advantage. All of the really advanced technology - whatever wasn't brought North - was at Landing. If there was anything else, those records would be at Landing as well. And he probably couldn't get anything to work, much less figure out what it was supposed to do in the first place, without extensive access to the computer archives at Landing.

Which he is NOT going to be getting, I'd bet!

Now, it would be funny if he found some little gadget and thought it was something amazing and important and it was, like, a toy...


Toric's contact at Landing (Elessin?) died, right after Abominator #5, so Toric must first find out what happened to either/both of them, and although Toric blames AIVAS for many of his woes, I think that Toric realizes that there is valuable knowledge to be had, or he'd never had Elessin (or whatever his name is, sorry, my books are never on hand when I'm online) pass on AIVAS information to him.

If Toric should get his hands on anything in AIVAS files, he'd use it to his best advantage...

I know the Catherine Caves and Honshu were found in the 9th Pass novels, but I do recall a few things that have yet to be accounted for, but then again, I have yet to get my hands on All the Weyrs of Pern and Chronicles, and a bunch of short stories I never knew existed until earlier this week!

Still, I don't think there were any weapons of any sort introduced by the colonists, as they wanted to leave war far behind them. Even if it was something that could help Toric overcome dragons & dragonmen. Perhaps the sport-cats developed by Tubberman could be just that weapon...

Now, what does AIVAS have on file about Tubberman's cats?
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Old Apr 10 2014, 05:21 PM   #26
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Quote:
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Pinch aka Master Mekelroy
Aha! Thanks, I was still thinking of Nip & Tuck from MHoP.
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Old Jul 1 2015, 02:24 AM   #27
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I wonder hat kind of blackmail Toric had on Ellessin?
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Old Feb 9 2017, 03:06 PM   #28
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Quote:
I really can't see there being anything left to find in the jungle that would give him an advantage. All of the really advanced technology - whatever wasn't brought North - was at Landing. If there was anything else, those records would be at Landing as well. And he probably couldn't get anything to work, much less figure out what it was supposed to do in the first place, without extensive access to the computer archives at Landing.

Which he is NOT going to be getting, I'd bet!

Now, it would be funny if he found some little gadget and thought it was something amazing and important and it was, like, a toy...
If Toric wants to get to AIVAS, what he needs is a teenage son or grandson with a similar mindset to his own (females not excluded, of course). Send him to Landing under an assumed name and enrol him in the school for a few turns, and eventually recall him, pick his brains, and start plotting. But would the child necessarily go along with those plans after exposure to an advanced education?
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Old Feb 9 2017, 05:06 PM   #29
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Well, if he's a sprout off the old branch he'll use the knowledge he gains against Toric instead of for him.
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Old Feb 9 2017, 06:18 PM   #30
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Now that WOULD be an interesting story line . . . hm-m-m.
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