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Old Mar 14 2008, 04:08 PM   #1
fireflyk
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Default Size of the weyrs?

When the first dragons hatched, it was easyto tell about how many existed. However, when I tried to look at numbers of dragons in the later weyrs, the best estimates I could find were '300-600 per weyr'.

Does anyone know what number MOST weyrs had during intervals vs. during passes?
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Old Mar 14 2008, 10:05 PM   #2
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Default Re: Size of the weyrs?

Hi Fireflyk, welcome to the MoM forum!

I don't think there is a better figure than that, though there are clues here and there. For instance when Lessa brought the five Weyrs forward, if I remember correctly, that was 1800 dragons or about 360 per Weyr. They were from soon enough after a Pass ended that I would count that as a normal Pass population, rather than Interval.

I don't think there's any good sources for a normal Interval population. We know Benden had dropped to 200 dragons or so, but there's not enough to know whether that was standard or extreme. I'd make an argument for it making sense as a standard, as the population can ramp up very quickly with a few queens, but that's not the same as evidence.
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Old Mar 15 2008, 12:43 AM   #3
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Default Re: Size of the weyrs?

Somewhere in DF or DQ there is a reference to Benden having something like 500 individual weyrs, although not all were occupied and Benden was down to as little as something like 170-190 dragons.

Various peripheral references of varying acceptability give Weyr populations of about 300-500.

There is a reference in DB to Telgar having approximately 600 dragons at one point when the facility was hosting the combined population of Telgar and temporarily abandoned Igen, and was also early in a Pass.

I believe CoP: FF contains a reference to Fort having reached something like 500 prior to founding Benden.

I believe there are references in DF or DQ to the maximum population of dragons being about 3,000. DF notes that Lessa brings forward about 1800 dragons of five Weyrs.

A thread-fighting treatise in the Mayfair game by Todd McCaffrey explicitly states Weyr organization is about 300-360 dragons per Weyr, with each Weyr boasting roughly nine wings of 30-33 dragons each. This would give just about 300 dragons with roughly one queen per hundred. On top of this you can presume some number of weyrlings and some number of over-age pairs that would probably be parceled out as watch-dragons to the Holds. So another 60 dragons that are either over or under fighting age would not be unreasonable. In the breeding run-up to Pass, a population peaking at 500-600 would also be reasonable.

The only reference to specific maximums is a wiki entry that does not give its sources but specifies the following:

Fort-500
Benden-600
High Reaches-500
Igen-300
Ista-350
Telgar-400

The Telgar number is specifically contradicted by the information in DB...maybe. For all we know, they could have been "double-bunking" or "hot-racking" weyrs at Telgar. We have really been told very little about the living conditions in weyrs, particularly at the beginning of Pass. The most detailed descriptions we have are for early 9th Pass, in a depleted Weyr (Benden) and in five other Weyrs populated to end-Pass numbers and attended by queens who are already slipping into Interval breeding mode vice Pass breeding mode. So we never see the 9th Pass Weyrs at maximum capacity. DB actually gives us our best look and that is for early 3rd Pass. And unfortunately for saying anything definitive, the situation at Telgar is specifically unusual.
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Old Mar 15 2008, 03:58 PM   #4
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Default Re: Size of the weyrs?

Or the Telgar number isn't referring to DB, since I'm pretty sure the Wiki entry came first. It's also possible the numbers vary a little with each pass or Interval so that group of numbers might only be a rough average and not accurate all the time.
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Old Mar 16 2008, 12:19 AM   #5
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Default Re: Size of the weyrs?

Thanks!

The sharing of weyrs is what really got me.
I mean, weyrmates share a Weyr sometimes, right? That's the meaning of, well, being weyr mates. So seeing that with mentions of Benden having 500 weyrs made me think...Could one place really hold 1000 dragons, if most/many of the riders were paired off? Even if only half the riders were Weyrmated, that'd still be a lot of double-filled Weyrs!
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Old Mar 16 2008, 05:14 PM   #6
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Default Re: Size of the weyrs?

Does being weyrmates mean that there is room in one weyr for two dragons? I can't imagine that ALL weyrs have that kind of space...
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Old Mar 16 2008, 11:03 PM   #7
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Default Re: Size of the weyrs?

For the blues & greens it would not need to be real big. If it is a gold & bronze dragon pair then it would need to be much larger.
I do not get the feeling that Ramoth & mnemoth (SP?) are sharing the same space. there may be conecting werys, with a comon & sleeping area shared. With the dragons seprate.
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Old Mar 16 2008, 11:19 PM   #8
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Default Re: Size of the weyrs?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brenda View Post
Does being weyrmates mean that there is room in one weyr for two dragons? I can't imagine that ALL weyrs have that kind of space...
Maybe. We've been told very, very little about weyrs, other than queens' weyrs and those of Weyrleaders. Even F'nor and Canth are squatting in a queen's weyr courtesy of Ramoth's queen bee attitude. Perhaps the best description is F'lar's quarters as a bronze rider in DF prior to assuming the Weyrleadership. Given that the room in F'lar's weyr is quite ample to Mnementh, I see no reason a couple of greens or blues could not be squeezed into the available space on cold nights. That's probably the only time the weyr would have two dragons in it and one or both would likely be out sunning themselves during the day. The sleeping quarters described would be more than ample for two riders, and nothing says one or both wouldn't sleep nestled up to a nice warm dragon on cold nights anyway.

I would doubt that all of the weyrs had such space. I'd imagine they vary in size within a Weyr, and such doubling up would only take place immediately prior to and during the first Turns of a Pass. Attrition would probably rapidly knock a weyr down from running about 20% beyond its quartering capacity as they get the hang of fighting Thread, and with dragon breeding rates keeping pace with attrition, the population would probably be stable at around the maximum capacity for much of the duration. Toward the end of Pass as the queens' rise less frequently, the population would begin to decline to well within limits.

Last edited by ElectricDragon; Mar 16 2008 at 11:21 PM. Reason: Possessive
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Old Mar 17 2008, 03:43 AM   #9
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Default Re: Size of the weyrs?

I guess, fireflyk, that like with apartments, weyrs are to be had in various sizes. So if weyrmates (which in my honest opinion always live together) want to live together and te weyr is too small, they just move to a lrager one. I'm guessing there are all kind of sizes available.
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