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Old Dec 3 2015, 04:47 PM   #1
CuriousFlit
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Default What Would Happen...

. . . if, in the future of Pern after the Last Fall, we end up with a situation like the one in Dragonflight? The dragonriders are creating their own farms and taking up crafts to provide solely for themselves in retirement, and finding new jobs for their dragons. But what would happen when the average holder and Lords forget the Falls again, and question the dragons and their riders existence and if Thread ever even fell?

Would the holders eventually turn on the dragonriders?

And what of Aivas? And the "abomination" group?

Could the Pernese branch out from their world and use their dragons to travel through space, with the riders becoming Pern's version of NASA?

In short, what do you guys think will happen in Pern's future After the Fall?

Thoughts?
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Old Dec 6 2015, 05:41 PM   #2
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. . . if, in the future of Pern after the Last Fall, we end up with a situation like the one in Dragonflight? The dragonriders are creating their own farms and taking up crafts to provide solely for themselves in retirement, and finding new jobs for their dragons. But what would happen when the average holder and Lords forget the Falls again, and question the dragons and their riders existence and if Thread ever even fell?

Would the holders eventually turn on the dragonriders?

And what of Aivas? And the "abomination" group?

Could the Pernese branch out from their world and use their dragons to travel through space, with the riders becoming Pern's version of NASA?

In short, what do you guys think will happen in Pern's future After the Fall?

Thoughts?
The knowledge will not be lost again. Robinton set things in motion to assure that the Pernese will not loose knowledge again.

1 all the knowledge in the AVIAS files are being hard copied and placed in libraries across the planet.

2. The landing school and the new craft halls again spread out across the planet. More importantly all the craft masters and Wyer leaders are committed to the preservation of all knowledge going forward.

3 fanderal is producing computers and the necessary replacement parts

4 the dragons can not leave the Rukbat system, too long between.

5 Pern will end up with a mid to late 20thcentury type civilization without fossil fuel powered industries. Think green and renewable energy such as solar, wind and water.

6 the Dragons provide air transport and will be the replacement for the sleds that the original colonists brought with them.

7 the abominators movement started dying out once Shankolin was killed by the AVIAS security system.

For some more speculation I believe that Jaxom if he put his mind to could recover the AVIAS program. After all AVIAS was a program so his algorithms can be recovered or reprogramed. The main computer on the Yokohama is an AI system too. Sallah makes note on the bottom of pg72 hard cover copy of Dragons Dawn "Most of the computer's vast memory had been duplicated for use on the surface, but not all" this means that AVIAS is only a copy and that the Yokohama's computer is an AI system too.
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Old Dec 6 2015, 06:59 PM   #3
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Default Re: What Would Happen...

Would a trip outside the Rukbat system really be too long Between? I thought the trips to the Red Star were only long because of the travel through time that was being done. Although, figuring out how to let a dragon breath from a spare air tank might be a problem, even though they are strong enough to carry some...
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Old Dec 6 2015, 11:04 PM   #4
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Default Re: What Would Happen...

I'm not sure if Fandarel was manufacturing computers and replacement parts by the end of Skies of Pern, but they do finally have a printing press, so they can reproduce anything that was printed from the AIVAS before it shut down.
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Old Dec 6 2015, 11:17 PM   #5
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Would a trip outside the Rukbat system really be too long Between? I thought the trips to the Red Star were only long because of the travel through time that was being done. Although, figuring out how to let a dragon breath from a spare air tank might be a problem, even though they are strong enough to carry some...
Remember, over 2500 years have gone by, so if you're thinking of them going back to look at Earth and the first colonies, they have no visualization to give the dragons.

They might be able to put together some kind of leak-proof habitat that the dragons could move to one of Rukbat's other planets or one of Pern's 2 moons --- perhaps to start a mining base if they were running out of some essential mineral. I can't see much point in them going any further from Pern, but some unforeseeable emergency might make it desirable.
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Old Dec 6 2015, 11:41 PM   #6
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The Abominator movement didn't die with Shankolin. The woman in the group (Fourth) went looking for Toric at the end of SoP, and he was certainly ready and willing to start something with the Weyrs. And Shankolin had told him he had plenty of supporters who were opposed to the new technologies, though not where they were located. But the harper spy Pinch was keeping an eye on Toric and Fourth with his fire-lizard Bista.
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Old Dec 7 2015, 02:45 AM   #7
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I'm not sure if Fandarel was manufacturing computers and replacement parts by the end of Skies of Pern, but they do finally have a printing press, so they can reproduce anything that was printed from the AIVAS before it shut down.
Yes, he was looking for folks, in The Dolphins of Pern, talking over with Master Nicat, he had stop making good on the speed of deliveries, also need find the sealant for some of components to make water and air tight
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Old Dec 7 2015, 02:11 PM   #8
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Fandarel and Nicat did put together some kind of hand-held communicator (in SoP, I think). That's more like computer technology --- unless it was more of a walkie-talkie set, I can't remember the details, or what its range was.

I'm not sure Pern has the resources for technological improvements to become widespread, at least at the level cell-phones are available on Earth --- computer components require some pretty rare elements. At the very least it might be decades, even centuries, before the crafters got around to making some of the less needed items.

Probably the Weyrs, crafthalls and major holds would buy whatever they considered useful and could afford, and most places would own a lot less technology but be able to rent access to certain services and equipment when they needed them. Many would not be able to afford much at all, and either resent that, condemn technology as anti-traditional (those Abominators again, or the Luddites of our Industrial Revolution), or make a virtue of necessity and manage to live without it. More like 19th or early 20th century for most people, with some a lot better off. Now that would make an interesting novel!
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Old Dec 7 2015, 04:32 PM   #9
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Default Re: What Would Happen...

I wonder what Toric was up to though? He had too much to lose if he caused serious trouble. I wonder how far ahead Anne thought in the development of their characters? (or any author, come to that)
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Old Dec 7 2015, 05:23 PM   #10
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Fandarel and Nicat did put together some kind of hand-held communicator (in SoP, I think). That's more like computer technology --- unless it was more of a walkie-talkie set, I can't remember the details, or what its range was.

I'm not sure Pern has the resources for technological improvements to become widespread, at least at the level cell-phones are available on Earth --- computer components require some pretty rare elements. At the very least it might be decades, even centuries, before the crafters got around to making some of the less needed items.

Probably the Weyrs, crafthalls and major holds would buy whatever they considered useful and could afford, and most places would own a lot less technology but be able to rent access to certain services and equipment when they needed them. Many would not be able to afford much at all, and either resent that, condemn technology as anti-traditional (those Abominators again, or the Luddites of our Industrial Revolution), or make a virtue of necessity and manage to live without it. More like 19th or early 20th century for most people, with some a lot better off. Now that would make an interesting novel!
In SOP there is several references to computer terminals being installed in several holds. Certainly if the Pernese can operate in space and AVIAS directed them to a level of technology that allowed them to do so, they can put together computer boards and create computer parts. Computer parts do not have to be that complicated. Look at the computers of the mid 20th century, mostly just transistors. If the Apollo astronauts can fly to the moon with computers that are less sophisticated than many cheep calculators today then the Pernese would be able to create information storage devices.
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Old Dec 11 2015, 05:25 PM   #11
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Default Re: What Would Happen...

The Apollo missions did not have computers, the computers were on the ground. What they did was send readings (mostly automatic transmissions) to ground control. In Apollo 13, the pocket calculator which one astronaut had brought along was the most powerful 'computer' on board.

Printing presses are the best solution for Pern at the end of the dragon series, simple (relatively speaking) and easier to build.
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Old Dec 11 2015, 05:53 PM   #12
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Guidance_Computer
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Old Dec 11 2015, 08:32 PM   #13
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Yep, they used very long slide rules, on the ground to calculation, they had input the information, by hand to the different systems, more later
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Old Dec 11 2015, 10:50 PM   #14
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Default Re: What Would Happen...

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Printing presses are the best solution for Pern at the end of the dragon series, simple (relatively speaking) and easier to build.
I come from a printing background. I've never been comfortable with the sort of printing press AIVAS was describing. He said that it would require rolls of paper, but that would be something along the lines of a newspaper press, a 'web' press. Printers churned out a great deal of printed matter on basically the same style press from it's invention (in the western world) till at least the time of the American colonies.

With the cleverness of Fandarel I think the very most they'd ever need is a sheet fed rotary press. Even that seems like overkill to me. (how many thousands of copies of ANYTHING would they need?)
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Old Dec 12 2015, 12:49 AM   #15
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With the cleverness of Fandarel I think the very most they'd ever need is a sheet fed rotary press. Even that seems like overkill to me. (how many thousands of copies of ANYTHING would they need?)
They were putting out something like a newspaper in SoP. Those pamphlet things they were having the runners carry to help educate the people about the new tech and counter the lies of the Abominator group.
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Old Dec 12 2015, 05:06 PM   #16
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They would produce a number of basic textbooks for the harpers to take to all the holds --- a basic History of Pern (including the Charter and the Hold/Weyr/Craft hierarchy), maybe a more detailed history for the harpers' use, Discovery of AIVAS (with diversion of the Red Star), and graduated readers for the children. Probably some interesting stories for the general population. I don't know how many holds and crafthalls there were by the end of SoP, but 1000 of each book would probably be the maximum at first. Most people wouldn't have their own copy of any book but would pass them around. This would change as the population grew.

Major Lord Holders might commission a history of their own Hold.
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