A Meeting of Minds - An Anne McCaffrey Discussion Forum  

Go Back   A Meeting of Minds - An Anne McCaffrey Discussion Forum > The Anne McCaffrey Collection > Dragonriders of Pern

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old May 30 2008, 03:23 PM   #1
Draconity
Inactive
 
Draconity's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Minnesota, USA
Gender: F
Now Reading: The Picture of Dorian Gray
Default Shoulder Knot Colors

I've been wondering what determines a shoulder knot's secondary color. I've been to Sabria's site, but it makes no mention of how a secondary color is determined.

I would have thought that the Harper colors would be blue and white, considering that's the badge color. But I've seen some Harper knots with blue and purple, or blue and green. So how do we get the secondary color?

According to Sabria's site, once you've got both colors woven together, posted crafters weave in some ribbons that are the colors of the places they're posted. So, to me, that leaves out the possibility of the secondary color being a post color.

I'm really looking forward to making myself a shoulder knot soon, so I'd really like to get it right the first time! Any wisdom?
Draconity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 30 2008, 04:13 PM   #2
sjslack
Inactive
 
sjslack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Derby, England
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern
Now Reading: as usual
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

I always thought the shoulder-knot colour was Craft and Place. Or in a Rider's case, Dragon and place.

I'm afraid I can't help past that. ^^;
sjslack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 30 2008, 04:19 PM   #3
Draconity
Inactive
 
Draconity's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Minnesota, USA
Gender: F
Now Reading: The Picture of Dorian Gray
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Thanks for the input!

I originally thought that too, but then I read Sabria's knot chart again. It has two-color knots for people who haven't been posted yet. And at the bottom, there's a note that once a crafter is posted, he weaves in the two heraldic colors of his post location.

So I'm pretty confused. Hah.

Last edited by Draconity; May 30 2008 at 04:21 PM. Reason: dumb typo
Draconity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 30 2008, 04:35 PM   #4
sjslack
Inactive
 
sjslack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Derby, England
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern
Now Reading: as usual
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Perhaps where they were born?
sjslack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 30 2008, 04:36 PM   #5
Draconity
Inactive
 
Draconity's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Minnesota, USA
Gender: F
Now Reading: The Picture of Dorian Gray
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

That's a good and logical possibility! Hmmmm.
Draconity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 30 2008, 04:38 PM   #6
Emeraldrose
Holder
Drudge
 
Emeraldrose's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Tennessee
Gender: F
Fan of: Dragonriders Series
Now Reading: The Great Hunt Robert Jordan
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

I, too thought that the colors were based on place as well as craft...Number of knots and other differences determine rank do they not?

Will have to review DragonLover's Guide to Pern...
Emeraldrose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 31 2008, 12:43 AM   #7
Lady Maelin
Master Artist


 
Lady Maelin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: California
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern,The Ship Who Sang
Now Reading: Anne's Pern EVERYTHING !
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Dragonity....I never could make a lot of sense out of the whole proper shoulder knot thing, either between the Dragonlovers Guide or Sabria's site. So I just decided to go with a combination-ish of the two...choosing to make them with the knots denoting rank...and or the colors of the cords used being all the different colors of the dragons. The tunics or clothing in general suggesting Dragonrider, Lord, or craft in the colors that were used.
I hope you find something that works for you.
__________________
"To the Horsehead Nebula and back we shall make beautiful music"..."Together!"

The stories of childhood leave an indelible impression,and their author always has a niche in the temple of memory from which the image is never cut out to be thrown on the rubbish heap of things that are outgrown and outlived........Howard Pyle
Lady Maelin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 31 2008, 12:46 AM   #8
Draconity
Inactive
 
Draconity's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Minnesota, USA
Gender: F
Now Reading: The Picture of Dorian Gray
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

It does help me, Maelin. Thanks very much. I'm glad to know, in a way, that there's no absolute consensus, since then I can't mess it up horribly!
Draconity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 1 2008, 09:30 AM   #9
Cheryl
Master Archivist
 
Cheryl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Maryland, USA
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern!
Now Reading: Paladin of Souls (Bujold)
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

I had my harper's knots made just of blue, no secondary color.

In the next day or two I'll try to look up what the Ista Weyrbook had to say about colors. Failing more clear guidelines from the DLG or the books themselves, I look to it as the most authoritative source for details like this, as the authors (Harry and Marilyn Alm) contacted Anne for approval most every time they strayed passed what was in the books.
__________________
Visit one of the other sites of Cheryl's Anne McCaffrey Triad:
Sariel's Guide to Pern: a detailed guide to the series
The Many Works of Anne McCaffrey: largest fan site about Anne and ALL of her works
McCaffrey Quest: annual trivia contest.
Cheryl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 3 2008, 06:13 AM   #10
adaezelabelle
Inactive
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: UK
Gender: F
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Doesn't Menolly wear Harper blue plus a lighter blue when she is a journeyman / woman? I think the way she bands her fire lizards is maybe some kind of clue - Maybe shoulder knots work the same way.
adaezelabelle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 4 2008, 02:45 PM   #11
Draconity
Inactive
 
Draconity's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Minnesota, USA
Gender: F
Now Reading: The Picture of Dorian Gray
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

That's a good idea, Adaezelabelle. Thank you! I hadn't thought of that. Great clue!
Draconity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 8 2008, 05:41 AM   #12
GinnyStar
Dolphineer
Craftmaster
 
GinnyStar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Wausau, WI USA, Central Standard Time
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern, other SF works
Now Reading: Dragonback Bargain
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Cove Hold Badge Had a Harper Blue Harp on a Green Backgound

Last edited by GinnyStar; Jun 25 2008 at 03:11 AM.
GinnyStar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 22 2008, 05:47 PM   #13
GinnyStar
Dolphineer
Craftmaster
 
GinnyStar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Wausau, WI USA, Central Standard Time
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern, other SF works
Now Reading: Dragonback Bargain
Question Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Quetions: Runner = Foot Messagers. Before Drum Hights and Wyer?
Rank Cords and Colors?
I know that they have station master and stations, use number e.c. Fort is 300 talk about in MHvP and Runner of Pern what is their color by the way?

Also Healer change from purple to a green in the SvP.
__________________
Lover s s, s and friends
Lover of and beads,
http://www.change.org/profiles/GinnyStar
Dragoncave GinnyStar2
Jellied Dragons
Lair of Dragons
http://dragcave.net/user/GinnyStar2
Thanks! Others: None at this time
WIP http://archiveofourown.org/works/252259
http://www.daisy.org/learning-difficulties
GinnyStar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 23 2008, 09:48 PM   #14
Greenrider Tresa
The Contrary
Planetary Brain
 
Greenrider Tresa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Northern Indiana
Gender: F
Fan of: The Ship Who Searched
Now Reading: The Calhoun Collection, Nora Roberts
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

I think the change in healer colors could be an error. Or maybe it separates apprentices from journeymen and masters. Not likely, I know, I'm not being serious.

Can't recall any mention of runners having colors. Possible they don't have formal cords and just wear the badge of whtever Hold they're nearest. :;shrug;:
__________________
Thinking, understanding, reasoning, willing, call not these
Soul! They are its actions, but they are not its essence.

Akhenaton? (c. B.C. 1375)
Egyptian King and Monotheist


Greenrider Tresa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 23 2008, 11:08 PM   #15
GinnyStar
Dolphineer
Craftmaster
 
GinnyStar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Wausau, WI USA, Central Standard Time
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern, other SF works
Now Reading: Dragonback Bargain
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

They use a belt with stiches in for runer, it in the short story Runner of Pern.
Healer Green is only in SvP.
__________________
Lover s s, s and friends
Lover of and beads,
http://www.change.org/profiles/GinnyStar
Dragoncave GinnyStar2
Jellied Dragons
Lair of Dragons
http://dragcave.net/user/GinnyStar2
Thanks! Others: None at this time
WIP http://archiveofourown.org/works/252259
http://www.daisy.org/learning-difficulties
GinnyStar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 24 2008, 01:05 AM   #16
Emeraldrose
Holder
Drudge
 
Emeraldrose's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Tennessee
Gender: F
Fan of: Dragonriders Series
Now Reading: The Great Hunt Robert Jordan
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

The Healer Green could be connected to the Post AIVAS records of Surgery and be a reference to Surgical scrubs but if so it was an error on the part of the new Surgeons as Green is an Unlucky color on Pern....Lessa and F'lar wore green to a Telgar wedding and F'lar got into a duel with one of the oldtimers......

Last edited by Emeraldrose; Jun 25 2008 at 08:37 AM. Reason: spelling error typing in the dark
Emeraldrose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 25 2008, 03:08 AM   #17
GinnyStar
Dolphineer
Craftmaster
 
GinnyStar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Wausau, WI USA, Central Standard Time
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern, other SF works
Now Reading: Dragonback Bargain
Lightbulb Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emeraldrose View Post
The Healer Green could be connected to the Post AIVAS records of Surgery and be a reference to Surgical scrubs but if so it was an error on the part of the new Surgeons as Green is an Unlucky color on Pern....Lessa and F'lar wore green to a Telgar wedding and F'ar got into a duel with one of the oldtimers......
I know that feeling try typing when your finger are cold and stiff. My hands get that way sometime.

Emeraldrose I fix the extra f you had in F'lar in your quote. By the way MasterHarper Robention wore green too. Something about fellis as dye I thing.
__________________
Lover s s, s and friends
Lover of and beads,
http://www.change.org/profiles/GinnyStar
Dragoncave GinnyStar2
Jellied Dragons
Lair of Dragons
http://dragcave.net/user/GinnyStar2
Thanks! Others: None at this time
WIP http://archiveofourown.org/works/252259
http://www.daisy.org/learning-difficulties
GinnyStar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 12 2008, 08:08 AM   #18
Rissa
Inactive
 
Rissa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Gender: F
Fan of: Fantasy
Now Reading: Dragonlovers Guide to Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

hehe..For my first post, I decided to tackle a sticky subject.

SHOULDER KNOT COLORS!

If we're trying to stick to the two string way of making shoulder knots..this is what I have so far. I like using more strings, because it if you cant tell..dark red..from sunset red, or even dusty red...you could easily missread a color.You also quickly run out of color options. But For this system, this is what i've come up with.

The colors come from the Weavercraft chart of Colour and Dyeing.. I changed a few slightly, when I noticed a fwe holds sharing the same colors. The ITSA list is intersting..but they hide colors..by calling anything not the prime color..the Weyr color. Which makes it REALLY DIFFICULT..to know which variation to choose.

So..if I have read things correctly...FOR CRAFTERS:
One color stands for your craft..the other for the area that you are currently working out of.


Since crafts all have white..the other color is their primary color

Farmers= white and golden yellow
Harpers= white and rich (Harper) blue
Healers= white and purple
Herders= white and yellow
Miners =white and black
Seacrafters= white and sea-blue
Smiths =white and red
Starcrafters= white and bright red
Tanners =white and sienna-brown
Traders= white and steel-grey
Vinter= White and dark red (wine color)
Weavers= white and lavender
Woodcrafters= white and forest-green
Bakers=white and green
...............

Weyrs, a friend of mine noticed, ALL have black in their color. The other color is the color of the main hall they fall under. So:

Benden Weyr =red and black
Fort Weyr =brown and black
High Reaches Weyr =dark blue and black
Igen Weyr =golden yellow and black
Ista Weyr =bright orange and black
Southern Weyr light =light green, emerald green and black
Telgar Weyr =black and white

Dragonriders also wear a third cordweaved thru..with the color of their dragons.
...............
And now the hardest one...the HOLDS.
I seperated the holds that shared colors with their weyrs..and went from there to pick out their primary colors.

It also appears that some holds share colors of the craft that is most known in that area also. So, trying not to conflict with other colors already in use, I now have this...

Balan Hold =azure
Balen Hold =pine-green
Benden Hold=dark red
Big Bay (Igen Sea) Hold =beet-red
Bitra Hold =dusty red
Cove Hold =light green
Crom Hold =yellow-gold
Fort Hold =brown
Greenfields =aqua
Greystones =violet
Half Circle Sea Hold = medium blue
High Reaches Hold =dark blue
Igen Hold =golden yellow
Ista Gar Hold =turquoise
Ista Hold =bright orange
Katz Field =-red
Keroon Hold =peridot-green
Lemos Hold =light blue
Nabol Hold =light brown
Nerat Hold = orange
Red Sands Hold =sunset red
Ruatha Hold =dark brown
South Telgar Hold =bright red
Southern Boll Hold =light red
Southern Hold =emerald green, light green
Telgar Hold = white
Tillek Hold = blue
Valley Hold =green

Also:
Holders wear the 2 or 3 colors of Hold.
Lords and Ladies of the Hold wear a gold or silver thread also, depending on wethere their house is a major or minor house.


Other things I noticed:
Children, New residents, and Drudges wear a single loop, in the main color of the Hold.
......
Canidates wear a single loop with one knot..that is white.

---------------
If this seems to work out, I'll work on the designs for the ropes next.

If you see any problems..PLEASE let me know!!..
Im new at this..and I want to get it a grap on it.

Thanks!

Ris'sa


*I cant help it..I braid stings for fun!* :-p

Last edited by Rissa; Sep 13 2008 at 03:03 PM.
Rissa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 13 2008, 11:22 PM   #19
T'mynn
Inactive
 
T'mynn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Anywhere, Everywhere. Maybe Pern.:-)
Gender: F
Fan of: All books
Now Reading: Chronicles of Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Only string I've avaible are some big skeens of DMC embrodry floss. Only colours I have are the coffee brown, navy blue and some red. I never could find a consistant image for description of the thickness,of these cords, or the diameter size. (SMall circile that's attached to the clothing, or the larger circle that's worn like a military guy's cord.)
T'mynn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 14 2008, 01:55 PM   #20
Eriflor
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Gender: F
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

If you go by the Dragonlovers Guide to Pern it's relatively simple, at least for Weyr and Craft.

Weyr:
Primary colour: the Weyr you belong to.
Secondary Colour: your dragon's colour if you have one.
Style of knot indicates rank.
Women and drudges wear a simple cord in the primary colour of the Weyr.

Crafts:
Primary colour: the craft you belong to.
Secondary Colour: the location where you're employed. (I assume unassigned journeymen wear a colour indicating the craft-hall location.)
Style of knot indicates rank.
Apprentices wear a knot in the primary colour of the craft only.
Non-craft staff? no details given.

Holds:
"A Holder will indicate his Hold of origin by wearing a round badge displaying the heraldry of his Hold, or a shoulder knot woven with the appropriate colors and a combination of silver or gold thread to designate whether it is a major or minor Hold."
Not much help with the shoulder knots. And I don't know if this refers to the Lord Holder or any resident of the Hold. I expect the 'appropriate colors' would be those in the badge. But considering that silver or gold thread would have to be made with actual silver or gold, I don't think they'd be handing these out to all residents, so maybe just family, or even just the Lord and Lady Holder, would use the metallic cords.

Eriflor.
Eriflor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 14 2008, 03:27 PM   #21
T'mynn
Inactive
 
T'mynn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Anywhere, Everywhere. Maybe Pern.:-)
Gender: F
Fan of: All books
Now Reading: Chronicles of Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

OOHH Much thanks Eliflor. That makes better sense so R'issa and I won't need to have to juggle a bucketload of string.:-D Only 2 colours reflecting craft/Wryerf,a badge to reflect hold affiliation in the HOLD's colours.

I'd been to that site and one other, since the graphics don't really show the actual plaiting well, because of monitor and /or graphic card limitations. becaue of that limitation, I was going to come up with a design that I hope will work.

Here's a description.

two 'cords', each 'cord is a three or four plait braid for strength, stability, also easy identificaition of primary weyr/craft colours. Every 2cm/1" I'll make a square knot with the 'cords", this is to keep them in place.

Secondary colours with be a thicker plaiting of maybe 6 floss strands in a three way braid. I'll weave that in between the primary cords, over and under the "Support " square knots.

The rank knots, I'll knot the primary cords and secondary in a normal single knot,
I hope this makes sense.


I'll try an ASCII image in Notepad and post it here

Last edited by T'mynn; Sep 14 2008 at 03:55 PM.
T'mynn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 14 2008, 04:22 PM   #22
T'mynn
Inactive
 
T'mynn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Anywhere, Everywhere. Maybe Pern.:-)
Gender: F
Fan of: All books
Now Reading: Chronicles of Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Dragonity,
I'll make one, take a digital image of it and psot it here so you can see if you like it. if you do, (and if I can get my brain to work right,need cofee or klah CHOCLATE defiantly.;-). ) I'll post how I did it.
T'mynn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 15 2008, 04:41 AM   #23
Rissa
Inactive
 
Rissa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Gender: F
Fan of: Fantasy
Now Reading: Dragonlovers Guide to Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Hmm...

I can see the 2 color bit working, as long as you dont get too many groups...then you would HAVE to add more colors soon.

As far aw Weyrs are concerned...
That cant be quite right. Since a weyr's colors are black..and the main color of the hold they service...you cant wear just 2 colors, and I think the Dragonlover's guide states that.

They wear the Weyr's colors (BOTH OF EM)..PLUS..a ribbon with the color of their dragon woven in between.

I agree on the crafts one..its just that Apprentices wear two threads..of the SAME color woven together.

On the Holds..
I saw its stated that the silver and gold threads were only for the Lord and Lady of the house.


To me, it looks like the knots are much more popular.

Otherwise, you could easily wear the badge showing where you come from, and then just wear a knot of your craft....which would make things a LOT easier, to me..instead of trying to remember all the colors and their combinations. Probably some issue of cost involved with badges as well. Or perhaps they are only used when traveling, or for special occasions, especially for hold folks.

Especially when you remember, this is going on medieval style type clothing.

I really HATE the way that they stated stuff.and the pics are even MORE confusing. As a single loop does NOT mean a single string to a braider. You can braid a big braided loop..with just one strand. Have to remember you do have to be able to SEE the colors well. And they also state, the the higher the rank, the fancier the knot. So while technically, you might still be only using 2 colors, I would definatelly think a Masters knot, would be fancier than the twisted apprentice knot.


Hey Mynn!

I think a badge would be somewhere between 3-4 inchess wide.

Man, If you wore your Knots, Badge..and then a rank pin...I dont think you would EVER need to wear jewlery You'd have no place to put it!


*Goes hunting for klah...*
Rissa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 16 2008, 06:26 PM   #24
GinnyStar
Dolphineer
Craftmaster
 
GinnyStar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Wausau, WI USA, Central Standard Time
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern, other SF works
Now Reading: Dragonback Bargain
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Hi all, I knew there was a good reason for me to keep this one active, working with knots work was a hobby I had to stop for I would have a cat or two wanting to play with the working end the the knot the cord, and my sight has not been the best. "sigh" I can't stay long to chat I have some work to get done on line.

Work job-school, than play later LOL
__________________
Lover s s, s and friends
Lover of and beads,
http://www.change.org/profiles/GinnyStar
Dragoncave GinnyStar2
Jellied Dragons
Lair of Dragons
http://dragcave.net/user/GinnyStar2
Thanks! Others: None at this time
WIP http://archiveofourown.org/works/252259
http://www.daisy.org/learning-difficulties
GinnyStar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 16 2008, 08:47 PM   #25
T'mynn
Inactive
 
T'mynn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Anywhere, Everywhere. Maybe Pern.:-)
Gender: F
Fan of: All books
Now Reading: Chronicles of Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

yeah it's a challenge but I'm gonna try the simple way first. I'm gonna try not to over think it.

I'm making my main braided loop if a chocolate brown. weave my red and blue braids through the holes I'll make in the loops.


(X) = 3 or 4 strand braid
@ = Square knots
II = 4 strand braid for the secondary colours
This is a potential pattern. The ASCII iamgery is a tad crude/ The squarknots are their for loop stability only. The ranking knots would be the entire strand( primary and secondary ) knotted together in a single knot or doublt knot depending on rank.(Or a single knot elsewhere on the loops or an inch or so down from the first knot.).
These lengths can be as short or as long as needed, maybe 2-4 inches apart or as little as 1-2 inches apart.

(X)II(X)
(X)II(X)
(X)II(X)
(X)II(X)
@@
@@
(X)II(X)
(X)II(X)
(X)II(X)
(X)II(X)
T'mynn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 18 2008, 12:12 AM   #26
ElectricDragon
Inactive
 
ElectricDragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Between
Gender: M
Fan of: Pern, obviously.
Now Reading: That's classified.
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

One potential reason for a change from purple to green for healers might be the difficulty of producing a purple dye. In Roman times "the Purple" was reserved for the emperor because of its rarity, which derived from the difficulty of cultivating and processing indigo. A green dye would be easier to produce from any number of plants.
ElectricDragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 18 2008, 01:59 AM   #27
Rissa
Inactive
 
Rissa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Gender: F
Fan of: Fantasy
Now Reading: Dragonlovers Guide to Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElectricDragon View Post
One potential reason for a change from purple to green for healers might be the difficulty of producing a purple dye. In Roman times "the Purple" was reserved for the emperor because of its rarity, which derived from the difficulty of cultivating and processing indigo. A green dye would be easier to produce from any number of plants.
Hmm.. I thought it had been changed from green TO purple. Like I need ANOTHER set of colors that are far too close to each other....*sigh*..oh well.

Hmmm...but, what you said about purple being harder to make, is definatelly true. What fun.

I also read the debate about wether the cords are worn around the arm, like a military braid...or above the arm. I know in some of the fancier braids, you have one going under the arm..and one going above the arm.

Maybe they do a bit of both. More of a military look for the Weyrs..and aboive the arm for everyone else...Oh well, back to researching...


Rissa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 18 2008, 08:40 AM   #28
Cheryl
Master Archivist
 
Cheryl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Maryland, USA
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern!
Now Reading: Paladin of Souls (Bujold)
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Definitely the healer color was changed to green not from green. Green was considered a bad luck color because of how greenery provides a target for Thread, so the supersititious Pernese were said to avoid wearing it.
__________________
Visit one of the other sites of Cheryl's Anne McCaffrey Triad:
Sariel's Guide to Pern: a detailed guide to the series
The Many Works of Anne McCaffrey: largest fan site about Anne and ALL of her works
McCaffrey Quest: annual trivia contest.
Cheryl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 19 2008, 05:01 AM   #29
Rissa
Inactive
 
Rissa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Gender: F
Fan of: Fantasy
Now Reading: Dragonlovers Guide to Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheryl View Post
Definitely the healer color was changed to green not from green. Green was considered a bad luck color because of how greenery provides a target for Thread, so the supersititious Pernese were said to avoid wearing it.
Soooo...they took a color thats considered BAD..and gave it to their Healers?!?! That really sounds wrong. Then again, who knows....
Rissa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 19 2008, 08:43 AM   #30
Cheryl
Master Archivist
 
Cheryl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Maryland, USA
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern!
Now Reading: Paladin of Souls (Bujold)
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

It was a surprising thing when it popped up in the books, especially without explanation -- made folks wonder if Anne realized she changed the color.
__________________
Visit one of the other sites of Cheryl's Anne McCaffrey Triad:
Sariel's Guide to Pern: a detailed guide to the series
The Many Works of Anne McCaffrey: largest fan site about Anne and ALL of her works
McCaffrey Quest: annual trivia contest.
Cheryl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 19 2008, 11:30 AM   #31
Lady Maelin
Master Artist


 
Lady Maelin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: California
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern,The Ship Who Sang
Now Reading: Anne's Pern EVERYTHING !
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

I think probably Green was chosen by Anne, because most of the herbs that were used by the Healers, are green...well at least when they start out.

The Healers Hall, didn't seem overly popular at times especially later on Pern when thier skills became somewhat more primitive....or if they tried to practice anytype of surgery. With the hit and miss medical knowledge of that time...healers would have been hated or loved depending on if their cures worked...as several of Anne's characters displayed.
__________________
"To the Horsehead Nebula and back we shall make beautiful music"..."Together!"

The stories of childhood leave an indelible impression,and their author always has a niche in the temple of memory from which the image is never cut out to be thrown on the rubbish heap of things that are outgrown and outlived........Howard Pyle
Lady Maelin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 19 2008, 02:18 PM   #32
T'mynn
Inactive
 
T'mynn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Anywhere, Everywhere. Maybe Pern.:-)
Gender: F
Fan of: All books
Now Reading: Chronicles of Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

It might even be one of her favorite colours. It's one of mine even if not every shade looks good on me. :-)

I can see the green being the chosen colour for healer's with their use of herbal poltices, teas. hereas on Earth we use a a combinaition of blue and green representing our life giving water AND greenery(herbals). The funny looking teal colour.

Now Thread seems to hit anything, if it falls similar fashion like rain. It doesn't care what it lands on, green or not. Unless there's book referances to Tread deviating it's downward course to land on a living thing as apossed to stone, water etc.

I'm teching myself how to use herbs as medicines, dyes not just for cooking.
T'mynn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 19 2008, 06:48 PM   #33
Brenda
Senior Member
 
Brenda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: St. Louis
Gender: F
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

I could have sworn maroon was the healers' color.
Brenda is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 20 2008, 01:18 AM   #34
Rissa
Inactive
 
Rissa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Gender: F
Fan of: Fantasy
Now Reading: Dragonlovers Guide to Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

ehh..I think I will stay with the Purple/Marron color for the Healers.

As there are already 2 green colors for the woodworkers guild...and the Bakers guild....

And I LIKE purple, dang it. hehehe

I'll chalk it up, just like when Ole Lucas mentioned "Metacholorines...", and never mentioned it again.. hehehe

And on another note, if anyone is intersted in diffrent types of braids...






This is a sampling of some braids I was playing with. I have close ups of the braids if anyone would like to see them...

*goes back to work on an idea*
Rissa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 20 2008, 03:01 AM   #35
T'mynn
Inactive
 
T'mynn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Anywhere, Everywhere. Maybe Pern.:-)
Gender: F
Fan of: All books
Now Reading: Chronicles of Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Nice work Rissa. :-)
T'mynn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sep 20 2008, 03:08 AM   #36
Rissa
Inactive
 
Rissa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Gender: F
Fan of: Fantasy
Now Reading: Dragonlovers Guide to Pern
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

P.S.

Just to clear some info..Im including the links to the most popular sites on the Knots in question.



http://soucon.silvertree.org/info/knots.html

http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Vault/2726/knots.html

http://www.kadanzer.org/zipfiles/handbook/knots.pdf
Rissa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 18 2010, 05:16 PM   #37
GinnyStar
Dolphineer
Craftmaster
 
GinnyStar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Wausau, WI USA, Central Standard Time
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern, other SF works
Now Reading: Dragonback Bargain
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

[QUOTE=Eriflor;119203]If you go by the Dragonlovers Guide to Pern it's relatively simple, at least for Weyr and Craft.

Weyr:
Primary colour: the Weyr you belong to.
Secondary Colour: your dragon's colour if you have one.
Style of knot indicates rank.
Women and drudges wear a simple cord in the primary colour of the Weyr.

Crafts: <sinp> A round badge DLGP2 pg 166
Primary colour: the craft you belong to.
Secondary Colour: the location where you're employed. (I assume unassigned journeymen wear a colour indicating the craft-hall location.)
Style of knot indicates rank.
Apprentices wear a knot in the primary colour of the craft only.
Non-craft staff? no details given.

Holds:
"A Holder will indicate his Hold of origin by wearing a round badge displaying the heraldry of his Hold, or a shoulder knot woven with the appropriate colors and a combination of silver or gold thread to designate whether it is a major or minor Hold."
Not much help with the shoulder knots. And I don't know if this refers to the Lord Holder or any resident of the Hold. I expect the 'appropriate colors' would be those in the badge. But considering that silver or gold thread would have to be made with actual silver or gold, I don't think they'd be handing these out to all residents, so maybe just family, or even just the Lord and Lady Holder, would use the metallic cords. Could they just use a single thread twisted into their knots/badge? I'm thinking 'metallic yarn'
Craft jouneyman is light color then say a master, here.
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat
White Dragon V2. Anne McCaffrey. CHAPTER I. At Ruatha Hold, Present Pass, 12th Turn ...... Harper blue with journeyman light blue, separated by white ...
zzj.itf-inc.com/.../Microsoft%20Word%20-%20McCaffrey,%20Anne%20- %20White%20Dragon.pdf
__________________
Lover s s, s and friends
Lover of and beads,
http://www.change.org/profiles/GinnyStar
Dragoncave GinnyStar2
Jellied Dragons
Lair of Dragons
http://dragcave.net/user/GinnyStar2
Thanks! Others: None at this time
WIP http://archiveofourown.org/works/252259
http://www.daisy.org/learning-difficulties

Last edited by GinnyStar; Dec 18 2010 at 08:28 PM.
GinnyStar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 19 2010, 02:56 PM   #38
GinnyStar
Dolphineer
Craftmaster
 
GinnyStar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Wausau, WI USA, Central Standard Time
Gender: F
Fan of: Pern, other SF works
Now Reading: Dragonback Bargain
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

http://books.google.com/books?id=fqy...anding&f=false

Dolphins of Pern Formal Tunic, Master Knot Paradise River hold Colors
__________________
Lover s s, s and friends
Lover of and beads,
http://www.change.org/profiles/GinnyStar
Dragoncave GinnyStar2
Jellied Dragons
Lair of Dragons
http://dragcave.net/user/GinnyStar2
Thanks! Others: None at this time
WIP http://archiveofourown.org/works/252259
http://www.daisy.org/learning-difficulties
GinnyStar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 19 2010, 04:14 PM   #39
Hans
Master Archivist
 
Hans's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: The Netherlands
Gender: M
Fan of: Pern!
Default Re: Shoulder Knot Colors

Ginny, I'm sorry, but again, please do not revive an over two year old thread to just post a quote.

If you feel the subject needs revival, or if you have something to share with us, start a new thread on the subject with a new aspect or opinion please, not just a quote to material elsewhere.
__________________
Hans, also known as Elrhan, Master Archivist

Visit The Pern Museum & Archives for all your Pern and Anne McCaffrey News and Resources!
The Pern Museum & Archives is the home of the Pern Encyclopedia and the Pern Bloodlines.
Hans is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Dragon Eye Colors? pictish-princess Dragonriders of Pern 51 Jul 11 2010 05:04 AM
Fanfic: The Skyboom (An Alternate Universe Pern Fic) D. M. Domini Exhibit Hall 4 Jun 2 2008 11:59 PM
Crystal Colors and Other Good discussion Topics MikeyD Crystal Singer and Brainships 14 Mar 4 2008 02:22 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:04 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

A Meeting of Minds forum owned by Cheryl B. Miller.
All references to worlds and characters based on Anne McCaffrey’s fiction are copyright © Anne McCaffrey 1967-2008, all rights reserved, and used by permission of the author.