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Old Jan 27 2008, 07:48 PM   #121
Brenda
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

Yes, because they specifically mention that quote and how they always thought it was referring to Fort Hold as the oldest Hold.
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Old Jan 29 2008, 09:43 AM   #122
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

It also depends a lot on the people making the quotes, and what they know of history.

Yes, I know, several of us groan at the inconsistancies and errors that exist between the books, and possibly wish that Anne had had enough foresight to know that her books would become so well liked, and be published, and be successful, as to spend the time to develop every aspect of Pern before actually writing about it (mind you, would she have ever found time to write about it if that had been the case?).

I tend to view the book intros - as seen the in the context of the publication order of the books, (which many of us have read them in) as giving us hints of Perns past, without actually telling us everything about Perns past, and allowing the author leeway in exploring those areas herself. In themselves we see Pern's back story beginning to unfold little by little, hinting at riches yet to come...

Anybody else noticed the dates given for the First Pass in the Dragondex at the back of Moreta?
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Old Oct 23 2008, 04:01 AM   #123
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

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Anybody else noticed the dates given for the First Pass in the Dragondex at the back of Moreta?
<sinp>

I did

-Eight year after Landing, Fall started they created the dragons.

Along the way there is a bit of time in CoP too.

Off by a year as far as I recall.
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Old Oct 24 2008, 12:05 AM   #124
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Default Re: (Potential Adult Topic) Dragons Sexual Selection

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No, I'm not. I'm referring to Gidget's post about their ancestors being treated with Eridani drugs, the exact circumstances of which were not specified. If, in fact, the effects of that work were not entirely beneficial, or appreciated, or the administration of such drugs was not entirely voluntary, it might explain why people might chose to forgo other procedures. It is also possible that such experimentation may have been undertaken with the best of intentions and have gone wrong. Whatever the circumstances, it might make people leery of similar, if lesser treatment, or they might reject such things on moral or philosophical grounds.
<snip>
The main effect mentioned in DD was a tendency towards greater empathy, which was considered a useful trait for healers.

Eriflor.
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Old Feb 5 2009, 02:55 AM   #125
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

I kinda assumed that they took a sample of reproductive material in the form of sperm or ova during the screening process, or when putting people into the deep sleep for travel. They had the DNA banks ready in the ships beforehand.

Didn't they also bring a few elderly people with them for the new colony? I'm sure they hardly expected them to produce children. Most likely the homosexual members were encouraged to foster or 'experiment' with others of the opposite gender while there material collected earlier was scattered to volunteers. After all, homosexuals would only compromise 1-3% of the population, tops.
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Old Feb 5 2009, 04:21 PM   #126
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

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<snip>After all, homosexuals would only compromise 1-3% of the population, tops.
Come again? Where did you get THAT?

My impression was that the percentage was much higher as my impression is that it will be significantly higher in the western world in the coming centuries, let alone in the coming millennia...

Or is this a case of projecting current day terran values on Pern?
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Old Feb 6 2009, 12:02 PM   #127
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

Homosexuals can and do have children the usual way. However, in a society without homophobia it seems an unnecessarily harsh way to go about it if there are alternatives available.

The scale of homosexuality is sliding, it's not absolute. It's certainly possible that the ratio of exclusive homosexuals might be about what DD says.
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Old Feb 7 2009, 10:54 PM   #128
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Isn't it mentioned in DD they wanted people to "spread" the genes around? 2nd or 3rd chapter I think it was. I would take that to mean that for the first few years, the women would select whom they would father a child with, even if they had a perminate partner. The stricture of "making sure the child is well provided for" could be a offshoot of the early years. This concept may even have been reintroduced after the first plauge years. It has been shown to be a common practice of holders and wyer folk were very loose in the solid relationship field. Wyerleaders and craftsmen are the ones who seem to have a more solid single relationship.
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Old Feb 8 2009, 12:20 AM   #129
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

Except in certain cases, Old Hippie, where there is a solid relationship after a "loose" relationship. Jaxom comes to mind with this thought. He spent some weeks with Corana and as much as he liked her, he knew that there was no long term relationship with her towards the end. If there was a baby as a result, it would be cared for. When he found Sharra, the long term "solid" relationship comes into being and they became "life-time" partners. That was the first thought that popped into my head when I read your comments. So there will always be some who have "loose" relationships (one night stands etc) and those who have solid, long term partnerships, however I'd go with the opposite and say that it's the holders and craft people who tend to go for more permanent relationships and the dragon riders who are very loose on their relationships, with the exception of their dragons.
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Old Feb 8 2009, 09:21 AM   #130
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

Also remember that the moral set that prevails and the society that we see in the Ninth Pass is very different than that which the Colonists landed on Pern with.

No doubt after landing there was a kind of "breed, breed, BREED!" mentality, but even in DD we see far more evidence of nuclear families than not and that seems to be the 'norm'.
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Old Feb 8 2009, 06:30 PM   #131
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

IIRC the "Breed Breed Breed" mentality was also prevalent after the plague era of Moreta. Wasn't the plague a reason that women became more restrained in their roles. More "baby factory" than working in crafts...MHOP an anomaly of 9th pass era
The reason women preferred the Weyr life was not only more sexual freedom but if they were not into motherhood than no problem.
It seems that the Harpers were somewhat responsible for birth,marriage and death records (or am I off base here?) 2nd pass, 5th pass....yet no longer true in 9th?
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Old Feb 8 2009, 10:29 PM   #132
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

In DE/RSR we see people cranking out babies in order to add to their land allotments - see Debera's father.
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Old Feb 9 2009, 02:41 AM   #133
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

Mmmm, yes, apologies, I'd forgotten about the plague years!

However, there's no evidence that women had the freedom to choose which father for what baby. The nuclear approach seems to have been the way forward outside of the Weyrs. Whilst women were seen pretty much as uterus' (uteri??) on legs, the structure in which that happened was still through marriage.
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Old Feb 10 2009, 11:37 AM   #134
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

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Mmmm, yes, apologies, I'd forgotten about the plague years!

However, there's no evidence that women had the freedom to choose which father for what baby. The nuclear approach seems to have been the way forward outside of the Weyrs. Whilst women were seen pretty much as uterus' (uteri??) on legs, the structure in which that happened was still through marriage.
In the Holds, definitely, with the exception of Lords and their offspring. Remember how Jaxom was thinking that his girlfriend might not mind getting pregnant by him, even if they didn't marry, because being the mother of his son would still earn her family some benefits.

In crafts, probably.

In the Weyr, occassionally.

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Old Feb 13 2009, 04:43 PM   #135
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

The example there is valid, but from a Ninth Pass perspective.

Even after the plague years, women were expected to marry one man and have as many children with him as possible. And if he died, and she was young enough, then marry another one and carry on. It wouldn't have been 'permissible' (and I use marks there to denote the social side of that and not any kind of illegality or policing) for a woman to sleep with a man here, there and everywhere and have children that way.

There are exceptions if you look at the lady Robinton hooks up with in MHOP (although a 9th Pass example), and there were no doubt women who preferred their, uh, freedom over tradition. But a girl wouldn't grow to womanhood ever thinking that she really could or should live like that. It wouldn't be an option in their minds.

Does that make sense? LOL I'm having a strange week and nothing seems to be coming out right at home or work LOL
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Old Feb 17 2009, 01:05 AM   #136
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

I figured sean was talking of kids younger than him too and not babies- I mean, could a newborn baby survive a snake bite? much less a huge one! NO. well, not likely anyhow.
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Old Feb 25 2009, 02:12 AM   #137
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Default Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

Hmm just stray idea roll across my mind here. Cherry Duff and many of her kin came to Pern. Their was some in DD about grand kids coming along on a different ship They could be the one to put up the cash needed to get thing rooling.

There was also something in the Charter too about loss of rank, stake arages if they din't meet the requiment of the contract. Also something about short-term and or long-term contracts, amd twoard of the say mother and her offspring.

With my eye acting up, can't find any qutes.
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Old Oct 8 2010, 02:27 AM   #138
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Red face Re: (Potential Adult Topic) Dragons Sexual Selection

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eriflor View Post
The main effect mentioned in DD was a tendency towards greater empathy, which was considered a useful trait for healers.

Eriflor.
Both for animals and folks, and the group of dolpheers too.

Along with the dolphins. For they were volunteers, they only had what 25 in the pod, by the time of CoP: Dolphins' Bell 70 in the bay along with three calfed that year. They had 24 for one died for she was older then she said, something about her last calf

Old Thread but its helping recall something I'm working on.
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Old Oct 8 2010, 02:46 AM   #139
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Red face Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

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DOH!!!

I just remembered that all-important phrase!

"When mankind first came to Pern, he settled in the South, but found it necessary to move North to shield." without " " http://books.google.com/books?id=52v...ankind&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=52v...ankind&f=false

So they know that mankind came to Pern from somewhere else. But that was all that they remembered.
RoP: The Renegades of Pern
By Anne McCaffrey Also Robinton specials saw the 'fragments of this.'

Two bits I"ve found on this.
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Old Oct 11 2010, 11:16 PM   #140
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Gold Re: Pern Colonist Genepool topic

yes, they had kids...poor girls.

but what i find interesting is that there is no 'state/country' named for them on the Northern Continent. but Nahbi Nabol and Avirl Bitra do! how does that figure?

back to the topic-as long as this thread is, im sure someone has hit it-there are so many neat posts i would love to comment on!-in "DragonsDawn" i remember there being a bit where there was a discussion that *all* the colinests had to add to the gene pool, gay or not. and there was discussion between the leaders at another point about the marriages for that week,where i think the length of the time the couple stayed together was mentioned...not sure. but that however long it was, the man always provided for the resulting children. in at least one case, i kind of feel sorry for the wife, for personal reasons. Sallah Telgar had a crush on Tarvi Andiayar, but in the long run, it was sad for her, since he was more wrapped up with his work, and pretty much only noticed her when she came up with her "dawn attacks", as she called them. poor girl....he only really let her know he loved her when she was dying alone on the ship


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Don't forget Kimmer's kids with Kenjo's daughter

The moment she was a woman Kimmer was "all over her"
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