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Old Nov 8 2009, 01:35 PM   #1
WeyrSparrow
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Green Male Greens?

(Please excuse my noobishness if this is a question that has been asked before. I did do a search on it, but couldn't find any threads with relevant info.)

So I was re-reading Dragonflight recently, and a recent edition at that, and I ran across something that made me blink:
"An ill-timed swerve during the Spring Games had brought L'tol and his beast into the full blast of a phosphine emission from S'lel's bronze Tuenth. L'tol had been thrown from his beast's neck as the dragon tried to evade the blast. Another wingmate had swooped to catch the rider, but the green dragon, his left wing crisped, his body scorched, had died of shock and phosphine poisoning." (16)
Is this merely an early inconsistency which Anne has chosen not to edit out of the books? or I am I to understand that there actually are, per canon, male greens?

(Since I run an RPG this is a matter of especial concern - we purport to be canon, but have been going by the assumption that all greens are female since the game started - chiefly because all the other weyrs I'm familiar with do the same.)

Did Anne initially intended to have all dragons be male except for the golds? If so, why would she then make the greens female - and at what point in the books would that changeover have occurred? Has she ever mentioned anything about this in interviews?

I ask because I haven't re-read the entire series in years, and my memory is rather shaky, so I don't have clear personal recollection of when it might have happened. Maybe in Dragonsdawn or Moreta?
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Old Nov 8 2009, 01:47 PM   #2
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Default Re: Male Greens?

If it was, it got retconned fairly quickly. Anne later decided on who could ride which colour dragon , and Lytol's having a male green dragon was mentioned as being a case of F'lar having bad memory.
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Old Nov 8 2009, 01:47 PM   #3
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Default Re: Male Greens?

I think this was written before Anne came up with all the dragon rules. The first part of the book was meant to be a short story and at first was not meant to be3 continued. In all the other books L'tol's dragon is a brown.

Green dragons are females.
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Old Nov 8 2009, 02:15 PM   #4
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Default Re: Male Greens?

Oh, ok. That makes sense. I wonder why they never just edited that out when "Weyr Search" was combined into the full novel, though - seems like it would be easy enough to change a few troublesome words, rather then going to the trouble of talking about F'lar's bad memory later... Thanks for clearing things up. =)
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Old Nov 8 2009, 02:31 PM   #5
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Default Re: Male Greens?

It was a mistake that was made before Anne had everything thought out more. It was being corrected but the UK retypeset, for which Anne asked a few of us to correct all minor errors in Dragonflight, never materialised.

There are a number of these small errors (and some bigger ones) and we'll have to live with them. Anne herself always says that she never thought Pern would become the success it became
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Old Nov 8 2009, 03:39 PM   #6
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Default Re: Male Greens?

I don't think it's fair to call it an error, even. Anne just hadn't decided how things worked, and given she originally thought she was just writing a short story. Getting it fixed in a book that's been in print for decades would be nice, but it's not so much a mistake as a change in the world structure.
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Old Nov 9 2009, 06:06 AM   #7
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2cent Re: Male Greens?

I seen to recall L'tol's Larth being referred to as a blue at one time as well....
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Old Nov 9 2009, 12:31 PM   #8
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Default Re: Male Greens?

I canít tell, as I know (or at least think) that Lítolís dragon is a brown, but errors do happen. No one is perfect, and, as everybody says, Anne probably never thought what a success Pern would became. Weyr Search was probably just an idea, which later turned out to be a spectacular book.
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Old Nov 9 2009, 02:47 PM   #9
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Default Re: Male Greens?

Samsara, I only know of the one mention as green and later sources give Larth as a brown. If you could (re)find that blue mention...
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Old Nov 9 2009, 07:32 PM   #10
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Blue Re: Male Greens?

Hmmm, I could being going of course, but i will have a look...
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Old Nov 9 2009, 10:49 PM   #11
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Default Re: Male Greens?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samsara View Post
Hmmm, I could being going of course, but i will have a look...
Keep us posted please.
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Old Nov 11 2009, 05:02 AM   #12
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Re: Male Greens?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hans View Post
Samsara, I only know of the one mention as green and later sources give Larth as a brown. If you could (re)find that blue mention...
Nope, couldn't find it... I'm not sure why I have this memory, it's still nagging at me as if to say... "yes, you saw this reference", but.. nope... can't find it... I have 3 possible explanations for thinking this:

1.) I am going ... (distinctly possible, but I'm ALMOST positive that I am sane...)

or

2.) My brain could not accept the possibilty of a male green, so it changed 'green' to 'blue'

or

3.) I am getting muddled up with Giron from Renegades... Does anyone remember what colour his dragon was? Was it blue? (*crosses fingers in hope this explains it*)

Take your pick guys...
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Old Nov 11 2009, 06:59 AM   #13
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Default Re: Male Greens?

I'm pretty sure that Giron HAD a blue.

Can you imagine the problems if Mirrim had impressed a bronze?
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Old Nov 11 2009, 01:17 PM   #14
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Default Re: Male Greens?

That would be a big problem Ė especially if itís a Benden bronze Ė think of what would the Oldtimers say! Iím happy for Fílar and Lessa that she didnít.
And, of course, think of poor Jaxom Ė she was giving him a tough time when having a green. If she had Impressed a bronze Ė well, letís just say I wouldnít want to be in Jaxomís shoes if that ever happened.
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Old Nov 11 2009, 04:13 PM   #15
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Default Re: Male Greens?

The thought of Mirrim and whoever was the rider of the gold reacting to their dragons mating ........
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Old Nov 11 2009, 06:10 PM   #16
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Brown Re: Male Greens?

Heh heh! THAT would be interesting! But I too am glad that never happened....

Last edited by Samsara; Nov 12 2009 at 04:18 AM.
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Old Nov 12 2009, 02:22 PM   #17
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Default Re: Male Greens?

Quote:
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Heh heh! THAT would be interesting! But I too am glad that never happened....
I agree with that, but too Iím happy that didnít happen. Although, itís fun to think of it.
Maybe someone should write a story on that theme.
What do you think itíll be called?
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Old Nov 12 2009, 03:49 PM   #18
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Default Re: Male Greens?

They proably already have, just with different characters...
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Old Nov 12 2009, 05:53 PM   #19
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Default Re: Male Greens?

Somebody did a fanfic with Menolly instead of Jaxom getting Ruth. And I think somebody else did one where Jaxom instead of Mirrim got Path.
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Old Nov 13 2009, 10:20 AM   #20
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Default Re: Male Greens?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Talisath View Post
And, of course, think of poor Jaxom Ė she was giving him a tough time when having a green. If she had Impressed a bronze Ė well, letís just say I wouldnít want to be in Jaxomís shoes if that ever happened.
I don't know. I like Ruth's response to Jaxom when Jaxom asked if he wanted to fly Path. Ruth responded to the effect that he has already outflown Path.

GH
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Old Nov 13 2009, 12:33 PM   #21
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Default Re: Male Greens?

Quote:
Originally Posted by P'ter View Post
Somebody did a fanfic with Menolly instead of Jaxom getting Ruth. And I think somebody else did one where Jaxom instead of Mirrim got Path.
I don't know about that second one, but the first one is here.
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Old Nov 13 2009, 02:48 PM   #22
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Default Re: Male Greens?

Brenda was faster; I remember her story. A great idea; I especially liked the name of the dragon.
I know Ruth probably doesnít mind what Mirrim or Path think of him and Jaxom, but Jaxom does, and thatís a problem.
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