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-   -   Stake Holds (http://forums.srellim.org/showthread.php?t=8277)

Almaron Jun 30 2011 08:26 PM

Stake Holds
Like the maps in the various editions of Dragonsdawn, the occupant lists at the back of the book seem to be a bit scrambled - or at least, they are in my edition. Ted Tubberman is listed as living at Monaco Bay, while Jim Tillek and the Dolphineers are at Calusa. Some inhabitants aren't even listed, instead it gives a description of where things are. I'm pretty sure that the Araby listings are all over the place - First it gives the Tuareg land to some random settlers, then it doesn't mention the Sea of Azov's inhabitants, and states that Paradise River is Lake Caspian, courtesy of the Ostrovskies (which I thought were from Ierne in COP?)

Lest this gets too confusing, I'm going to make a quick list of what I have found so far. In case the names at the back are jumbled, I'm going to mark the ones not referenced in the story itself with an asterisk, and the names listed in the DLG with a "`".

AT TIME OF THREADFALL (8AL): est. 20,000.

1. Landing
Home To: All settlers without a Stake.
Inhabitants later fled north to Fort Hold upon eruption of Mount Garben & Picchu Peak.
2. Monaco Bay
Home To: Jim Tillek, Per Bagnesjo, Bernard Shattuck, & Dolphineers (Possibly Ben & Claire Byrne).
Fled north following eruption.
Jim Tillek remained at Big Island until death.
Dolphineers moved to Tillek Hold.
3. Calusa
Home To: Ted Tubberman & family, George Milan & family`.
Abandoned following the death of Ted Tubberman via felines.
4. Cambridge-On-Jordan
Home To: Cabot Francis Carter
5. Cardiff:
Home To: Bar Hamil-Jessup* (Alt. Barr & & Jess Hamil`)

6. Oslo Landing/Harbour
Home To: Gus Gustavson*`, Felicia Grant, () van-Toorn, Limpy Obrin`.
Annihilated in first Threadfall.
7. Amsterdam
Home To: Arvi Du Vieux & family, Holstrom family.
Annihilated in first Threadfall.
Holstrom family survived by Cyra Holstrom.
8. Bavaria
Home To: Radelin family & Duquesne family.
Annihilated in first Threadfall.
Radelin family survived by Catherine Radelin-Doyle.
9. Milan
Home To: Ciotti family
Annihilated in first Threadfall.
10. Bordeaux
Home To: Kwan Marceau*`, Pat and Aisling Hempenstahl & family*` (possibly Chuck & Sue Haver).
11. Vienna-On-Jordan
Home To: (Ilsa?) Langsam family*.
14. Killarney
Home To: Sean Connell & Sorka Hanrahan
Proposed but never actually settled, due to Threadfall.
0. Out And About (No Fixed Location)
Home To: Connell family, Foley family, Brendan family, Moorhouse family.
Survivors rescued following first Threadfall.
Presumably also home to Romani nomad settlers, who later moved north to Benden Hold (and possibly Lemos).

12. Tuareg Land (All of Araby is in fact Tuareg Land, but two main camps exist)
Home To: Tuareg settlers.
Main camp SW of Paradise River destroyed in First Threadfall (I'm sure I read somewhere that two babies were the only survivors - they were placed in a metal box or something - but I can't find the page).
13. Paradise River
Home To: Tim Andriadus (and family?)*`, Ben & Claire Byrne (listed by DLG at Monaco Bay), Duff*, Captain Kaarven*.
13a. Sea Of Azov
Settlement on Lake Caspian exists courtesy of the Ostrovskies.

15: Malay River
Home To: Phas Radamanth, Chuck Kimmage, Chaila/Chaika Xavior-Kimmage.
16: Xanadu
Home To: A.C. and Betty Soper & family*`, Xi Chi Yuen*, Cooney*, Duff* (possibly Steve; all others accounted for), Jepson* (probably a misprint).
17: Mexico on Maori Lake
Home To: Elizabeth Jepson`, Gunnar Schultz` (& possibly family?).

18. Sadrid
Home To: Wade Lorenzo, Athparkis, Jima, Bahka, Egend.
Newest Stakehold at time of Threadfall.
19. Thessaly
Home To: Gyorgy Logorides & family, Trury family*, Stepan Wlyadka.
One of first stakes claimed.
Decided to remain south initially, but had abandoned stake by 19AL.
20. Roma
Home To: Caesar and Ramona Galliani & family.
Decided to remain south initially, but had abandoned stake by 19AL.
21. Honshu
Home To: Kenjo & Ita Fusaiyuki & family, Vartry` (later Stev Kimmer & family).
Kenjo killed by Avril Bitra at Landing.
Stev Kimmer later moves in with Fusaiyuki family.
Fusaiyaki & Kimmer descendants ultimately evacuated from Pern.

22: Boca River
Home To: Paul Benden, Ju Adjai (Possibly Ban Larr & Mahmoud).
23: Suweto/Drake's Lake
Home To: Drake Bonneau and Svenda Olubushtu & family*.
Decided to remain south initially, but had abandoned stake by 19AL.
(DLG doesn't list Suweto, and groups Drake and Svenda at Drake's Lake)
24: Drake's Lake
Home To: Valli Lieb*`
25: Yukon/Drake's Lake
Home To: Bart Lemos*`, Saki Tiffin*, Blackie Nilwan* (Odd, Blackie has a father named Bart Nilwan, but neither's location is listed in the DLG).
DLG states that descendants of Bart Lemos later founded Lemos Hold.

26: Karachi Camp
Home To: Tarvi Andiyar, Sallah Telgar & family, Ivan Chernoff, Jivan Paramundi, Ozzie Munson`, Cobber Alhinwa`, Fritz Fremlich`.
Telgar Hold later founded by Tarvi.
27: Seminole
Home To: Cos Melvinah, Brooks family*, Peter Chernoff, Jacob Chernoff`.
Decided to remain south initially, but had abandoned stake by 19AL.
DLG states these moved to Benden (and possibly Lemos).
28: Key Largo
Home To: No inhabitants listed.
Decided to remain south initially, but had abandoned stake by 19AL.

Longwood: Tom Partrick, Bjorn Patrick` (Stake not listed, but likely with family).
Uppsala, Longwood, Lochahatchee: Bill Duff*', Andrew & Jennifer Kiersey Fremlich* (Alt. Andrew & Jennifer Kiersley` and a Fremlich?), Joe Tobin*`, Pei Pei Ting*`.
Decided to remain south when other stakes were abandoned. Was able to sustain itself due to a large native population of Fire-Lizards. Abandoned in 28AL in favour of founding and shifting to Benden Hold.
DLG states that several islanders founded Nerat & Lemos, and some moved to Tillek.

Bitkim Camp
Home To: Avril Bitra, Stev Kimmer, Nabhi Nabol, Dasha Chernoff, Purdee Mott, Tony Gale, Becky Nielson.
Inadvertantly abandoned due to inhabitants being recalled to Landing following Avril Bitra's death.
Later settled by four families whose names were used to make the acronym "Ista". Joel Lilienkamp settled here in later years, and so did Jim Tillek (I think). "Big Island" remained name as late as 28AL.
May have also been home to the settlers who worked under Nabol in a Thread-fighting squadron - it is possible that they were behind the founding of Nabol Hold.

So that's what I've found so far through quick checks. This could be useful in figuring out who ended up founding which hold, cause RSR/DE states that the Lord Holders were all important Stake Holders or something (although that doesn't explain Pierre De Courci). I've probably missed some things, but this can be edited later. Any notes?

EDIT: Updated with information from the questionably accurate lists at the back of the second DLG. Some of this is obviously wrong - last I checked, Patrice de Broglie didn't LIVE on Young Mountain - but I've added it to the list for now.

Lily Jun 30 2011 10:02 PM

Re: Stake Holds
My word! What a lot of work you are doing here

Kath Jul 1 2011 04:12 AM

Re: Stake Holds
As far as the Ostrovsky family go, they may well have had a stake off Ierne Island initially. But after Threadfall started and the bulk of the colonists moved north to Fort, the remainder stuck it out on Ierne, as a last centralised Southern settlement. The Ierne Islanders eventually came north as well, to settle at Benden.

Eriflor Jul 1 2011 01:14 PM

Re: Stake Holds
Torene was an Ostrovsky, and her parents were already settled at Telgar in 'The Second Weyr'.

GinnyStar Jul 1 2011 08:41 PM

Re: Stake Holds

Originally Posted by Eriflor (Post 177589)
Torene was an Ostrovsky, and her parents were already settled at Telgar in 'The Second Weyr'.

Also I recall her asking why 'Telgar' worked so hard, and them, before she impressed, so I think they worked at Karachi Camp, before, moving along with Telgar and his minning operatation, first working at Fort Hold, and then at Telgar, they are mining folks, and had maps of ther own too.

Also @

14. Killarney, pick as a name but never, clamed by Sean Connell & Sorka Hanrahan
Vienna-On-Jordan, was were the Out And About (No Fixed Location)
Home To: Connell family, Foley family, Brendan family, Moorhouse family.
Survivors rescued following first Threadfall.

Almaron Jul 1 2011 11:56 PM

Re: Stake Holds

Vienna-On-Jordan, was were the Out And About (No Fixed Location)
I think that's a misprint, cause it only says that on the map at the beginning of the book, which Hans pointed out elsewhere has varied in each publication. The back of the book only lists one family living there - the Langsam family.

I think it was intended to be a separate thing that got incorrectly labelled - mainly because none of the families listed as Out And About were anywhere near Vienna when Thread fell - the Connells were hiding in a cave in East Kahrain - and that Vienna is never mentioned in association with their names in the story, as far as I saw.

The only other stake marked with O.A.A is Stake 12: Tuaregs, and we know from DD itself that they had two main camps which they constantly shifted between, having essentially all of Araby to themselves - at the time of Threadfall, they were at their camp SW of the Paradise River, which resulted in all of them being wiped out (save for two babies placed in a small metal cabinet - found the source for that after looking again!).

On the other hand, multiple families did live at Stakes...perhaps Vienna was a sort of home that they could use if they were in the area, or return to if they got sick of wandering.

Almaron Jul 4 2011 10:22 PM

Re: Stake Holds
Just updated the list with several families and other things that I'd missed the first time round.

Am I the only one that finds it odd that Drake Bonneau doesn't live in the settlement that bears his name? It seems like he should be in Drake's Lake Stake, as opposed to Suweto, unless someone else later came and named their stake after the lake, but each stake is listed at the back along with Drake's Lake, suggesting it's a sort of title, so surely Drake would live at "Drake's Lake", the first settlement?

Not sure where the Haver family go - they could either be in Bordeaux or Calusa, but more likely the former.

I always found it odd that the Sea Of Azov had a settlement "courtesy of the Ostrovskys", when all Araby was supposed to be Tuareg.

It seems that basically a few people would found a stake, and then other families would move in with them.

Does anybody know what happened to the Romani settlers? I assume they're a part of the Kahrain O.A.A, cause they're not a part of the Tuareg O.A.A (which was annihilated), and the DLG states the Romanis later moved north.

I think that's all the things I meant to say for now; I might find more later though.

Brenda Jul 5 2011 12:18 PM

Re: Stake Holds
I thought they named the lake after him because he discovered it? That doesn't necessarily mean he'd choose to settle there.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Romani, and the other traveling folk, contributed to the population of Liliencamps Traders.

Eriflor Jul 5 2011 10:26 PM

Re: Stake Holds
There was a Foley (one of Porrig Connell's extended clan) with the group that founded Ruatha. She was a good animal trainer (especially sheep-dogs and other herders). I imagine most of that clan would be good with horses, and a few would accompany any new group of settlers to help with the horses.

And as you say, Brenda, they'd most likely gravitate to the wandering life of the trader clans.

Almaron Jul 7 2011 03:46 AM

Re: Stake Holds
Another update - I added information from the DLG lists. It appears to have confirmed several of the placements of characters not mentioned anywhere else, but also corrected the spelling of a few names and shifted their placements.

Something of note, Bart Lemos is listed in the back of DD as being at Yukon Stake along with Sakki Tiffin and Blackie Nilwan. DLG expands on this, confirming that Bart was at Yukon with Blackie. Interestingly, it also lists a Bart Nilwan, but it doesn't say where he was.

I forgot to note it, but it's possible that the Ostrovskys were at Karachi Camp if they were miners - that seemed to be the dominant area on Pern for mining.

Almaron Dec 10 2011 05:32 PM

Re: Stake Holds
Alright, now this should be helpful! I've gone through Dragonsdawn (and First Fall, for that matter) and noted EVERY character so that pages can be written for them on the wiki.

At the moment it's not sorted in any order, but a good deal of the minor characters have numbers detailing what pages they appeared on or were mentioned on. Major characters...not so much. I used what I believe is the Corgi 1998 printing; paperback with green cover and Steve Weston art.


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